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Jake Harris | Sometimes We Have to do Things That Suck

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Hosted by
Mike Ayala

On this episode of Investing for Freedom, Mike is joined by guest Jake Harris. Mike and Jake discuss the importance of family, hard work, knowing where you want to go in life, and the benefits of understanding construction when investing in real estate.

“If you don’t know where you want to go, then it doesn’t really matter what you do.”


Jake Harris is the founder and managing partner of a private equity real estate firm that has managed, developed, and acquired more than $200 million in assets under management in the last five years alone. Jake has a master’s degree in international real estate and is a licensed California broker and recognized expert in opportunity zones, infill development, construction cost-control systems, and the scaling of distressed investing business. To learn more about creating financial freedom through real estate investment, visit


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0:00 – Intro
1:12 – Jake explains why a mentor of his, Dan Chadam, has had the greatest impact on his life
7:20 – You may not need to understand construction to be good at real estate but people that don’t are at a serious disadvantage
9:07 – Jake speaks about how his experience in the army has had a great impact on his success
10:53 – Sometimes you just have to do hard things that suck
11:31 – Mike asks Jake what his greatest setback was and what he learned from it
13:55 – Action. Do it. Ideas are shit.
14:40 – Everything comes from imagination
21:08 – Jake shares his opinion on finding and securing deals
22:56 – Mike shares a quote from Jim Rohn; “The difference between where you are today, and where you’ll be five years from now, can be found in the quality of the books you read”
24:56 – Jake speaks about his book Catching Knives (coming April 26th) and explains why it’s one of the most impactful times to invest in real estate 
26:05 – If you don’t know where you want to go then it doesn’t really matter what you do
29:21 – Mike asks Jake what drives and motivates him every day
30:15 – Jake talks about his goals of being a better husband and father, and how he wants his family to see him
39:07 – Jakes discusses how his wife is the axis on which his world spins
41:23 – Jake speaks more about his book and long it took him to write it, he explains that it was 15-20 years of his life that’s given him the tools to write this book even though he wrote it in less than a year


Mike Ayala: Thank you for joining me on the Investing for Freedom podcast. Today I’ve got an episode that we’re bringing to you with a good friend of mine, Jake Harris, and I think you guys are going to really appreciate Jake, his depth of wisdom and knowledge, and experience in the real estate world. We’re just going to get into some amazing stuff today, but more importantly, I really appreciated getting to know Jake over the last couple of years because he’s just a genuinely good guy. And that’s what we’re really looking for in the world is you know, people who are smart and talented and just out there getting shit done, but are also good people because if we can’t have fun with good people, then what the heck are we doing? So, Jake, thank you for being on the show.

Jake Harris: Hey, thanks Mike, and I think the feeling is mutual. I think each time we get a chance to connect, it kind of deepens that relationship. And it’s very valuable hearing about you and your journey and your family and man, your kids you know Dylan and seeing him take over the world is a pretty exciting thing.

Mike Ayala: Well, I appreciate that. And I appreciate the love as always. So Jake let’s jump into the questions. So who has had the greatest impact on your life?

Jake Harris: You know, the easy answer is my parents, you know, my mom and dad because, for different reasons, but I want to take it to you know, there was a guy, a mentor and I say that a little bit loosely is, his name was Dan Chatham. He was a contractor and developer, and I got out of the army. I was you know, 23, I wanted to grab the tiger by its tail. I’m like, Hey, I’m going to get into real estate. And I asked him, and I was bartending at a country club, and I talked to Dan and I was just like, Dan, like, you know, what do I do? And he actually told me a little nugget of information. You know, which I think I included in the book there I don’t know how in-depth but what it was is that get into construction. He said because the guys that get into the trades know how to do real estate. Like, it just, they figure it out because contractors want to make as much money as they can possibly make and take as long as possible. And so the reality is like, you can learn this thing through books or trial and error, which might take you 10 years to figure out, or you start in the trade and you shorten that window. And then you’re just more profitable out of the thing. So Dan told me that and I went okay. And it was like a light bulb kind of moment. He then followed that up with a subsequent kind of thing was, I was debating about, you know, I talked my way into this position at this commercial construction company. And then it was like, we had a sticking point on like the salary like the job was listed for $60,000 a year, but they didn’t really want to pay me that because I was not really qualified. It was kind of like bugging me that they weren’t paying me that, what they had it even listed or considering paying me. And he said, what do you care what they pay you, you’re going to make millions of dollars off of the knowledge that you gain there, you know, and it was kind of like, you’re going to get an education and they’re going to pay you for it. And it was like that, that again, the light bulb moment, and there was kind of that sticking point. Cause I was like, man, if I can’t get paid, then I can’t leave this other job. And so what I did was I went in and I said, Hey, here’s the thing, I have three extra days a week you know, when I’m not bartending, I’ll come in and work for free, doing that job because I know I can figure it out. And it was that light bulb moment of one, getting in construction. And then number two, that it’s not about what they’re paying you. It’s just peanuts compared to what the big macro vision of what, you know, you say you want to do. And so I was like, alright. And I would work and so I would say he was someone that had a tremendous amount of impact to my life. I mean, as far as, you know, and I say that person that he impacted my life is like, he was not a mentor in the way that we met every single week or month. You know, it was a combination of some you know, nuggets that he dropped off to me. And so, like, I wouldn’t say he was a mentor. Like I just asked him, I was asking questions and passing at a country club. And then maybe when I was on serving drinks and that there was like times that he had extra time. And so he was sharing his little bits of information that changed and metamorphis my life, those little nuggets of conversations. And then it put me on an entire path. As far as that, it’s not about trading your time for money. It’s not about what you’re going to get paid for that amount. And then also hacking and reducing the window in which you can create opportunity. You know, so learning construction first. Learning construction before you got into real estate like that’s a big nugget.

Mike Ayala: Yeah. And I think so many people miss this, and this is such an important, I’m really glad that you didn’t just stick with the obvious mom and dad answer because there’s so much value in everything that you just said. And, you know, I have a mentor in my life. He’s an older gentleman that has just taught me so much his name’s Barry. And I talk about them often. And I had somebody a while back asking me, like, how did you convince, it was actually doing the seven to eight shows for GoBundance and somebody in the text thread asked me, how did you convince Barry to be your mentor? And I said, well, I didn’t Barry to be my mentor. I went to Barry because I knew he was a hard money lender in the real estate space. And I didn’t really know him that well. I went to him to borrow money from him and he did a deal with me. And then we did some more deals and then we did some more deals. And then we did some more deals. And it would be just to kind of situation where, you know, there was a few times where I had some challenges in my life and I would go, you know, sit in front of him and just share the challenge with them. And he would help me through that process. And I think that point that you bring up about this, it’s not like the traditional mentor that we think that question that somebody asked me was, how did you convince Barry to be your mentor? Did you have to pay him? No, it’s the opposite actually, I didn’t convince him to be my mentor. And yes, I had to pay him a lot of interest over time to borrow money from him, but along the way, and this is what I think people miss so often along the way, I learned so much from him by doing business with him. And again, I think there’s that mindset that some people have all they’re thinking about is I’m going to go to work for eight hours. You know, I’m going to trade my time for money. I’m going to make $14 or $22 an hour or whatever it is. Some of the people that have taught me the most in life have been either client of mine that I’ve done deals with, or they’ve been literally mentors, as you’re saying that were bosses of mine, teaching me something in the trades. And then the other point, and if you want to expand on this, we can, or we can move on. But I love what you said about this guy, Dan teaching you about real estate through construction because there’s such a link there. And it doesn’t, I don’t believe that you have to understand construction to be good at real estate, but people that don’t are at a serious disadvantage.

Jake Harris: Yeah. And that’s, I am always trying to figure out your best return on investment, you know, as far as so, why I read a lot of books is that oftentimes is 15 years’ worth of someone’s life that they’re putting into a three hour-ish window of a book versus, you know, there are podcasts. This is, we’re going to high level go through things. An hour of that is not going to get the same depth. However, you know, even in a blog or, you know, these other things, it doesn’t have that impact that like a book does. And then, you know, like what he was saying, as far as construction, well construction took 10 years off of where I was going to need to go, like I could have trial and errored it, and that’s kind of the way is, so I make a mistake and do those other things and so on. That’s kind of really where this came out was how can you do that? Shorten your path because we all are limited on the amount of time that we have. And if we’re really trying to squeeze a little bit more juice out of it, we have to leverage this knowledge base in these ways to do that in a shorter time period.

Mike Ayala: That’s such a good point. I love all that. There’s a few things I might want to circle back on if we have time around that, but let’s go to question number two, if you could narrow it down to one thing that has had the greatest impact on your success, what do you think that would be?

Jake Harris: You know, I was in the army and I was in aerosol infantry and it a lot of times sucked. It was, you know, you’re carrying really heavy stuff. You’re hot. You know, I remember times being down in Louisiana, it’s like a hundred degrees and a hundred percent humidity, and you’re carrying 130 pounds worth of gear. And you’re, you know, neck deep up to a swamp and you’re dirty and haven’t showered in three weeks. And it was just the thing of putting one foot in front of the other, you know like the time was going to pass anyway, and it was going to suck, and it was still going to suck, and it was going to keep going through. And I think that fortitude compounding of just learning to do that over and over and over again, that was probably some things that my dad told me about when I was a kid, but I didn’t understand until I got into the army. And then I think that it was exasperated when, you know, in 2007, 2008 losing everything, you know, falling down, the housing market collapsing and, you know, sitting on a street corner in Tucson, out in front of Adobe house that I’m fixing up and I’m praying, dear Lord, can I be worth no money? You know and, you know, part of the thing, but it was just like putting that one foot in front of the other, in front of the other, in front of the other. And so that the army was impactful. And it worked for me. I think it probably is going to work, it would work for a lot of people. I’m not saying you need to go out and join the army, but sometimes you just got to do hard things and you got to do hard things that suck and dig ditches or do jobs that you don’t like. And because it creates that duality of things that guess what, sometimes when you’re digging ditches, you go, I don’t want to do this forever, but it puts perspective to you in when that, you know, cheques comes at the end of the week, or, you know, whatever it is, it has a lot more value. And so for me, that has been working with my hands, doing things that are hard and that suck.

 Mike Ayala: I love that sometimes we have to do things that suck. That’s probably going to end up being the title of this podcast, but we’ll see. What was your greatest setback and what did you learn from it?

Jake Harris: You know I would actually say success of the run-up of the subprime was because it was not, I was so myopically focused on becoming a millionaire before 30, and I neglected all other aspects of my life. You know, it was only about being a millionaire. It was not, I turned down friends. I wouldn’t go out with them if it didn’t, you know, hit in tie into that. And, you know, and then I achieved it and then I was, you know, successful, I’m a millionaire, I’m 28, like, look at these other things. But then, you know, I got, you know, overweight, you know, I was kind of an asshole, kind of lazy, you know, and it was just like, I let that success. And then it kind of like, look at how important I am. Like I did this, I achieved my goal. And the reality was, it was like, I just stopped, like, and what caused me to lose everything was being lazy and, you know, overweight and kind of being an ass and all the other aspects of my life. And so for me, that success is what, you know, and it was obviously the unwinding of all of that, seeing how I was bankrupt in every other aspect of my life. Cool, I had money. But, you know, what does that matter if you’re 80 pounds overweight, the girl that you were going to marry, dumps you. Your brothers are, you know, saying, Hey, Jake, you’re an ass. I’m not going to hang out with you. You’re isolated from the rest of the world, and it is just like, and then, you know, seeing that and feeling it back, it caused me to be very introspective into what did I do right, what I do wrong. And for me having to go through that, again, things that suck and then doing that kind of you know, starting back over was very, very you know, metamorphic.

Mike Ayala: Yeah. I love that. What is the single piece of advice you find yourself sharing the most?

Jake Harris: Action. Do it, ideas are shit. Everyone thinks they have the greatest idea. I have lots of amazing ideas all the time. Just ask me, I’ll tell you about all the great ideas I have. But it means nothing. If you don’t do work, you can read about pushups. You can watch videos about pushups. You can, you know, but if you don’t do pushups, you’re never going to gain the benefit from that. And so here’s the other thing that I think that very few people actually translate. It took me a falling down on my face and this has been a journey and I’m not there yet. I’m still on this journey, but it is that everything is a construct of imagination. And so when I say that is somebody saw and imagined the building, the house that you’re in, the bookshelf that’s sitting behind you. Someone thought about that. They said, ah, you know what, a house here in, you know, I don’t know, you’re Gilbert, or, you know, someone said, Hey, this would be a great place to put a subdivision. And then someone else said, this would be a great place to build a house. And they just thought it, and then what happens is it became reality. And so they created and did action that then created the reality in which we’re living in today. That chair that you’re sitting at, the trees that have been planted were, you know, happened because of some action item. And so when you also look at this is the time is the most precious commodity that we have. You can make more money. You can’t make more time. And so when that is, is like, just go do whatever it is that you thinking or wanting more, expiring to do is just go do it. And you’re going to make mistakes, guaranteed. We all are. And so when I peel that back is that’s the advice, I give to people is like, just go do, go do. I think about this and even my own limiting beliefs. So one of my goals and my thing is to build a high-rise, a skyscraper. And, you know, like in my mind, I put the sequences together, like I do this, and then I have this a $100 million worth of assets under management. Then I have these other things, you know, you put these things together, which is interesting because when I went to grad school down in Miami, there was a guy that had just finished building this high-rise condo. I was talking to him, he was like in his thirties or something like that. And he had come over to the country four years ago with not a dollar in his pocket, no education, and no money. And he’s like just finished this high-rise condo project. And I was like, tell me about this. He’s like, I just paid whatever the listing of the land that was listed for, I just bought it, put it on contract for that. And then I saw that there was a contractor building another one down the street. So I just called them up and said, how much would an architect and I just did it. He didn’t underwrite it. Didn’t do a pro forma. Didn’t do a market study. Didn’t do due diligence checklist. Literally just bought the land because it was listed on the market. He hired an architect to design a high rise, hired the contractor thing. Didn’t do any VE things. What’s the price, a hundred million? Great. When can we do it, went to the bank. And then just by walking around the streets in Miami, told people, Hey, we’re building this thing. And they got investors to come in that. And in three years he sold it out and he just sold it for 50% or 70% more than he built it for. And so he made twenty-five million dollars in four years building a skyscraper with no education, no part of thing. And it was to me, was like, how much is my own limiting beliefs also holding me back from that success where this guy was just like, man, I’m just here fresh off the boat. Let’s rock and roll.

Mike Ayala: You know, I was having a, I love that. That’s so inspiring. And I agree with that, you know, and I don’t think that either one of us are saying that, you know, you should never do due diligence or, you know, check your proforma or make sure that the number, I don’t think either one of us are saying that, but the reality is I was literally just having this conversation yesterday. I think we’ve probably talked about this, but I’m getting ready to launch a new fund and we’re going to roll up HVAC companies. And, you know, I’ve been going down this road of and I think about this in terms of even real estate, we were taught back in the day that, you know, you got to look at a hundred deals to really analyze 10, to put three under contract, to really get down to one deal. And I don’t, I’m not, you know, I think if you want to go out and grind, and especially in this day and age right now, as hard as it is to find deals, you know, those numbers might even be higher. But when I think back to when I first started getting, when I first got started in real estate, like deals would just start manifesting, excuse the word, but they would just start, things, opportunities would just start coming to me. And so I didn’t look at a hundred deals to get to 10 down to 3 to 1. And I knew there were so many deals that I did that I just knew that I knew that I knew that this was a good deal, jump on the opportunity, carpe diem, seize the moment. I’ve literally watched people freeze and let good deals pass them by because they’re frozen. And so when you’re talking about action, just do it. Like, just go get shit done. I love that. And so I was talking with a buddy of mine yesterday. I was thinking about the HVAC thing. Cause I bought a list of 12,000 HVAC companies in Arizona and Nevada. And I’m sitting here overwhelmed at this list because I’m like, how the hell am I going to narrow this list of 12,000 companies down to, you know, buy one or two or three or four of them in Arizona and Nevada? And, you know, I started thinking, well, I could go, you know, consult this out and they could narrow it down and we could cold call and we could do yellow letters. And then I told my wife, I said, you know, I’m just going to lean into it and just wait for, like, just look for opportunity. Like, I’m just going to open my eyes and this guy reaches out to me and he’s like, Hey, I’ve been listening to your podcast. I’m a general manager of a plumbing and heating company. Would you mind meeting with me? I’m like, I would love to. And I sit down with him and his boss is like my avatar seller. He’s Jim, he’s 67. Like he’s ready to sell. They’re doing $3 million in revenue. They can’t get it profitable because they don’t understand systems and processes. And the owner won’t get out of the way. And the general manager’s frustrated and he wants to stay there. And I’m just like, okay, so when you just lean into it and you trust God and you trust the universe like it doesn’t have to be that difficult, but I loved how you said, you know, also we can’t just like wait around on our couch and expect God to just bring us deals. I had to say, yes, I had to make a podcast. I have to talk about it. I have to say yes to the meeting. I have to look for an opportunity because sometimes I think the opportunity is right in front of us and we completely miss it. So I love everything you said there.

Jake Harris: So there’s some nuggets in what you just said there, as far as that action that you did as far as putting together, getting the list, doing those other things, putting the podcast. So here’s my belief as far as when you go you know, you go say a prayer, you know, to God or your creator or the universe or whoever is that you’re, you know, if you believe in a higher power, you know, I happen to do that. And so you say your prayer and, you know, Hey God, I want more money, or I want an opportunity to be patient, or you know, I want to be more patient or I want more money. God doesn’t just have a leprechaun show up and give you a pot of gold. Like what happens is he’s going to give you the opportunity to work towards that and or the universe is going to open the door and there’s going to be transpired. And most people miss that because it is work that showed up. I got to go do stuff for that opportunity. Hey, guess what? I want to be more patient. Well, guess what, you’re going to do things that try your patients. You want more money, guess what? You’re going to have to do things that push beyond your comfort levels. And so if you’re just okay with wherever you are in life. Yeah, this is probably not for you. You know, the book is like, would be like you are in content and you’re going to live the same year over and over for the next 20 years. And that’s what you want for what, you know and why we’ve connected is that it’s like, you want to love that more. You want a little bit more each year, cause you would be disappointed in your own self, if you are exactly how you were one year, you know, forward how you are today.

Mike Ayala: Yeah. I love that. And you kind of touched on the book. I definitely want to make sure that we spend a little bit of time talking about the book, but there’s that Jim Rohn quote that I’m thinking about, and it says the difference between where you are today and where you’ll be five years from now can be found in the quality of the books that you read. And I really feel like that’s kind of, you know, when I was just listening to what you’re saying, it’s taking action and it’s going out and it’s meeting people and its surrounding yourself with people that are smarter and higher. Just like Dan, the guy that said, you know, Jake, he was one of your first mentors or biggest mentors. So, number one, I appreciate the fact that you wrote this book it’s called Catching Knives, right? Yeah. And I’m super excited to get into it, but I’m just thinking about everything you just said. And, and that Jim Rohn quote comes to my mind because the difference between where you are today and where you will be five years from now will be found in the quality of the books that you read, and most will just pass this up. They want more in life, but they’re not willing to put in the work. And that’s what I heard you just say.

Jake Harris: Yeah. And you know, it’s, you know, a little bit, you see a lot of people right now that are unsatisfied in their life. The proverbial American dream is not what it’s cracked up to be. They went to the school, they went to the right place. They got the job working in corporate America or their law firm. And the reality now is that they’re working 80 hours or a 100 hours a week. They’re having a hard time, you know, getting to see their kids. You know, they feel, they may take that couple week vacation every year, but they feel anxious being away from work for those couple of weeks. Like they don’t have that shut off. And so for me was, you know, obviously as a believer in real estate, as you know, I say, this is the dumb man’s way of becoming wealthy is because, you know, you kind of invest into it and it kind of generates this wealth in search generating passive income if you’re doing it right. And so the book Catching Knives is, you know, specifically about distressed commercial real estate investing. And the reason why I believe that is one of the most impactful times to be investing is it actually also allows you to make the most room for error when you’re buying it, because you’re buying it at a discount to its intrinsic value. It’s harder to do things when it’s frothy. And like you said earlier, you got to look at maybe 10,000 deals to get one, it’s hard to find good deals, but then the deals abound when there’s distress in that market. But oftentimes you’re going to also have missing gaps in that. And so you need to put together a system for that. How are you going to approach these deals? How are you going to do that? And so that’s what I kind of put this book together for was one, a little bit, we touched on some topics of like, why are you doing this? Like, you know, and then, you know, like, have you ever thought about putting together, what is your dream life cost? You know, like, have you broken that down? And then what that does is that helps give you know, like your roadmap to where do you want to go. Because if you don’t know where you want to go, then it doesn’t really matter what you do. And so that direction will help you kind of get there. And it takes some of these lessons that I’ve learned over the last 20 years and gives some of that insight. And hopefully, like someone telling me in a conversation that was passing, get into construction, because it’s going to save you 10 years of your life. Well that’s kind of my thing is that you know, this book is going to maybe save people 10 years of their lives or maybe millions of and you know, that’s the backstory of why kind of just got put out into the world.

Mike Ayala: I love that. And so just for some context, I mean we’re sitting at I think today’s March 25th. This is going to launch April 1st and the book comes out April 6th, right?

Jake Harris: April 6th, it is official. So it will be on Amazon, Good reads, you know, I’ve never written a book before. I don’t know where all these things are out there. The book launch team and the publisher put them out there. And you know, what we’ll do is we have, a website that is where we’ll have some of those links to people can buy those bookstores everywhere, which really, I think just means Amazon. I don’t even know if bookstores still exist. But and then it’s going to have some, all their follow-on that we have some other follow-up content that’s going to be delivering out there. Some masterclass series is that dive a little bit deeper and then some kind of coaching, and then how people can get some connections for some speaking as well.

Jake Harris: So you know, I think depending on when you’re listening to this, you know, you may be able to buy it on Amazon at the time. If you’re not, you know, that Catch Knives will help get you out, but that Catch Knives is going to be a good place because we’re giving away some free resources and stuff. Due diligence checklist, you know, how do you find you know, certain deals, you know negotiated kind of like a template for an LOI. Some other things like that that people have been asking me quite a bit for, and then, you know what? And I know that we’ve shared some of these things back and forth, it is books, books that have been impactful to me, or help me along that journey is, so then there’s going to be some sources of those are the books that I’ve found certain nuggets of content out of. And so all of that will kind of be in that And then you can get the book April 6th. And I think the audiobook is going to be maybe late April or May, depending on that time period.

Mike Ayala: Cool. So we’ll circle back and just narrow that down as we’re wrapping up here in a few minutes, so what drives Jake? I mean, I want to, again, I want to circle back to the book and see, I can tell your passion. You’re always trying to help. You’re always trying to add value. I understand, you know, the purpose behind the book, but what really drives you, like what motivates you every single day, what gets Jake out of bed?

Jake Harris: You know, there was you know, I’m going to, I don’t want to steal this. You know when he dies and he goes to have, and he’s going to see the version of the man he could have potentially been, had he played full out and, you know, his goal is to be thee mirror image of that. And so for me, you know, that drive of getting better is always there. You know, cause like people ask like, well, when’s enough is enough and I’d be like, never, there is never enough. And it’s not about money. It is not about you know, levels of success. Money’s a good for a scoreboard, but you know, my goal is to be a better husband every single day. My goal is to be a better father every single day and every month you know, and not every day that I succeed at that. But you know, if continuum on a thing is getting a little bit better, a little bit better, a little bit better. And in every single aspect, am I getting healthier? And that intentionality of that, and I think what has been really, really metamorphic for me. And I’ve said that a couple of times is that being part of GoBundance was something being around other groups of people that are talking about it. You know, you won’t be able to see it on this, but you know, the goals that have got a lot more specific about what gives me my purpose is I was given a certain set of talents and skills, which are not like other people. And that for that version is like, I need to go put that out into the world and I need to be the best version that I can possibly be at every single day. And as a family man, first and foremost, you know my wife and my kids are the, the pinnacle of all of this. I would give up everything I’ve ever built and done in business for them any day of the week. And you know, the fact that they love and support me, allow me to go run around the country and chase down deals and, you know, do things like write books and do podcast interviews and they continue to support me. I think you and I, we talked about this too. I may butcher the quote “no man can exceed the opinion of his children.” And to me, it’s your know, if that’s the reality, you know, they don’t care how much money, money’s fake to them. I mean, money’s fake to the federal government too, but, you know, let’s be honest, but money’s fake, but you know what’s real? Dad loving them, dad playing with them, dad hanging out to them. And so there’s like, and when I go and we built a fort in the backyard, that’s real. And that builds memories. And so, which is interesting, we were in London and Hudson was like three at the time, yeah, it was three. And we were, he was looking at the construction sites and he said, Hey, is that your construction site, dad? Is that your project? I mean, there’s the skyscraper in London. I was like, Oh, wow. I wish this is my first time I’ve ever been in London. I’m not an international investment guy, but it was like the fact that my kids think that every construction project is my project. It’s kind of rad. So that to me being a dad and a husband is first and foremost to me I have a faith in God that I have a bigger purpose that beyond this world. And I need to do the best thing that I can do. Real estate is my creative way of solving, you know, and putting that through, you know, a mathematical kind of components and, you know, seeing opportunity in that space. And it fires me up to do it every single day. I jump out of bed and I love doing it. And so I just, that’s, that’s what I’m called to do.

Mike Ayala: I love it. And, you know, I’ve, I’ve often thought there’s a scripture in the Bible that says, what does it profit a man to gain the whole world, but to lose his soul. And so when you’re talking about like, you know, money and possessions, and even just bringing this back to time, I’ve often thought about that scripture in the context of you know, I know that’s talking about like, you know, losing your soul and when you were talking earlier about, you know, success and that getting in the way, and, you know, basically, you know, becoming an asshole. It’s really easy to lose your way. But I’ve thought about that scripture for years in the context of my family and my friends and people that are important to me, what does it profit me to gain the whole world and to have all the nice things and to have my time freedom yet, have no one to share that with, because I’m an ass hole. And so I love the, you know, the version that you just went through with what’s important to you and the kids and what the children value, because I hear this so many times and we’re fortunate to be in a group like GoBundance, but outside of that, there’s a lot of successful groups out there, the egos of the world. And even, you know, there’s group that I spend quite a bit of time with, you know, the focus is being a great dad and there’s so many conversations around, there’s this thought that I hear so many men say that I’m doing this for my family. You know, I’m building this, I’m working 70 hours, 80 hours, 90 hours a week for my family. And that’s bullshit. Like your kids don’t care. It’s one thing if you have to grind for a small season, because you’ve gotten yourself in trouble, or you, you know, you need to keep yourself out of bankruptcy or you got to deal going South or whatever, but that’s not a lifestyle. And I think we lie to ourselves and say, we’re doing this for our kids. And I love what you pointed out. The kids don’t care. They don’t care how much money you make. They care how much time you’re able to give them.

Jake Harris: Yep.

Mike Ayala: I love it. You know, I appreciate you, you know, being vulnerable and going there cause I’ve watched you and I know that’s what matters to you. And I know that’s what’s important to you and I appreciate that about you.

Jake Harris: Thank you. I mean, don’t get me wrong. I like doing successful and making money, doing deals. But yeah, I mean, if your, you know wife or kids called you up and said, Hey, you got to leave or fly to the other part of the country or across the world, be like, no problem, easy, you know, give up your business for them done. You know, and obviously, there was something I read or heard years ago, Donald Trump, somebody asked him if he was a good father. And he said, I’m a good provider. To me that just like hit me like a two by four. I was like, oh my gosh, I would never want to say that. Or even have my kids think that, or like, because you know, I think having success and then losing it puts that in perspective. You know, having those things that you’re just like money doesn’t, you know, it matters, but it doesn’t mean that much, you know, once you get beyond paying your bills and doing all those other things like that, it doesn’t matter that much. You know, cool, you go on a vacation, you flew, you know, a commercial airline or a private airline or whatever, does it really equate to that much greater capacity? Not really.

Mike Ayala: No, that makes a lot of sense. I remember a time and it was actually 2007. It was the end of 2007. And you know, we had a big client of ours go bankrupt. They basically closed the Gates of their mining property and owed us like $400,000. And then simultaneously, you know, the market’s crashing and our business is getting affected and we’re having to lay off 30 employees. It was a really, really challenging time for me. And I remember Kara, my wife saying, you know, you’re stressed out, you’re working all the time. This isn’t you. And I’m like, well, what do you expect? Like, you know, we could lose everything. And she looked at me and she said, what are they going to do? Take our kids. And I was like that, like, that just shifted in me. Because, and also Jake it had allowed me to put myself back in a mindset where I could actually fix the problem. Because you know, going down that road, like you said, being stressed out, not being able to see the light of day at the end of the tunnel, you know, I was in the wrong frame of mind to solve the problem. And when she said that it just snapped me out of it and that’s where we actually need to be in order to solve the problem anyway. So when you said a few minutes ago that, you know, money doesn’t matter, of course we all need money. I think anybody would be naive if they thought that you can get through life. Well, I guess you could get through life without money, but I don’t want to. The reality is we use money, but it doesn’t make us happy. And when we put money on a pedestal, you know, I like what you said, that, you know, the deals and everything that you love, when that gets out of balance, it gets really hard to actually make money. Things get so much easier when you keep that in alignment. Would you agree?

Jake Harris: Yeah. I mean, think about this when things are good with you and Kara, everything else kind of falls into place. Same thing with my wife, you know, she’s the axis in which my world spins around. Deals can be going sideways. I mean, let’s be honest, you know, you do lots of deals, there’s going to be some deals and there’s going to be problems all the time, 100% of the time, there’s things not going according to plan. And, but if my wife and I are good, like we are connected, we’re in a good, you know, kind of time. And it’s work, you know, to do that, creating intention around that, doing, you know, relationship books together, you know, even a John Howard has the ready set love program which does some kind of things of almost like physiologically kind of hacking, you know, as far as belly to belly hugs, every time we’d come home, doing things that connect like it’s those things that are very, very important to me that they become that priority. And if things are good with her, everything else kind of will fall in its place and those timings, like, they’re not going to take the kids. Everything else doesn’t really matter. If in, you know, be like, but I don’t know if this is, and maybe it’s exclusive to me, but the things are not going well. We’ve had, you know, kind of I walk out the door kind of you know, things are not great with my wife, everything else kind of stops. It’s like everything else kind of like everything kind of chips at you and it kind of piles on there and it just, you know, it explodes You know, just the saying that my, you know, relationship with my wife is core and as far as if it you know, it’s not right, it’s not like I’m blowing up stuff, but it exasperates the condition when things are not right with her as far as the whole rest of the world. When they’re good with her, everything else is, you know, is manageable.

Mike Ayala:
I mean, that’s so much value right there. I freaking love it. Well, I’ve really appreciated our time together and the conversation. I just want to give you a moment to talk about whatever you’d like about the book or any final last things. Yeah, just anything you want to share around that?

Jake Harris: You know, so yeah, the book you know, appreciate that people want to read the book, take time to do that. It you know, really, you know, somebody asks like how long did it take you to write it? And I said, well, I mean, I’ve been working on it the last like nine months or so, but I was like, really, it’s like 15, 20 years of my life that has gone into that. So it took me 20 years of living to get to the place to where I could write the book, I guess. And so I’m proud of it. I think it is pretty rad. I think it’s something, it’s the best that I could possibly do and put out there into the world. You know, I hope that I continue to get better and maybe in the future deliver you know, a better book or better version, but it’s the best I could kind of do. So I value that, that people take their time. They have an infinite amount of information in the world today. And if there’s something that people are looking to maybe get out of that hamster wheel, create something as far as start investing into commercial real estate, we’ve found that you know, where this was resonating really well with a lot of people is people that have had some levels of success in the residential, or maybe in the brokerage space or you know, doctors that are looking to kind of get into a higher-priced, you know, kind of deal set, but they don’t know how to do that. So I’ve tried to bring that all in is, you know, make it a much more concise and consistent way to understand it in a world that is overwhelmed with information.

Mike Ayala:
I love it. And the thing that I can say to my audience, our listeners you know, Jake, every interaction I’ve ever had with you has been amazing. So I’m sure the book is going to be no different. I appreciate you pouring your life into this book because I know the book is not you know, about how much money you’re going to make for you, but rather how much you can make and help people just find the success and the freedom of time that you have in your life. And so I appreciate you pouring all of that into the book. And so again, people can go to and sign up for the list and the book comes out April 6th. So if you’re listening to this after that go to Amazon, pick up the book. If you’re listening to it before that, make sure you go to and sign up for the list and do this for me. If you go sign up for the list and you take a screenshot or you buy it and you tag me in Instagram @themikeayalaa, I will put you in a drawing at the end of next week after the book launches and I’m going to send one person a copy of the rich dad cashflow game, which is, I think it’s probably a $75 or $100 game, and it’s really changed my life. So again, go sign up for Jake’s list or buy the book, either way, screenshot it, tag me at @themikeayalaa, and I’ll pick a winner and send them the cashflow game.

Jake Harris: Yeah, Mike, I’ll add on to that. I’ll also send you some autograph copies of that book too. Obviously, they bought it, and if they want to, you know, Instagram. So, I’ll add into that as far as some value for those people you know, obviously the support, I appreciate it. And you know, I’d love to get people on their venture into the real estate world.

Mike Ayala: I love it. So exciting. Well, again, thanks for being on the show. Thanks for sharing your love and your energy and excitement for just a better life. I appreciate everything that I know about you, Jake.

Jake Harris: Thanks, Mike. I appreciate the opportunity.

Mike Ayala: Yeah. Have a good day.

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